主题:Senses Initiated Lucid Dream (Ssild) Ld4All<mod>Continued in Part II </mod>
A little disclaimer: There are many similarities between SSILD and the other lucid dream induction methods such as WILD, MILD, etc.02 In fact, if you wish, you could label SSILD as a derivative of those methods, or you could simply write it off as an old method with a new name since the differences may be rather subtle. 02Also I'm not sure if this name has been taken, so if it was then please let me know so I can change it to something else.
Background02
While teaching lucid dreaming to novices I realize that many popular methods share a fundamental problem. 02That is, they all require too much finesse. 02For example, the typical WILD techniques require proper relaxation which by itself is a difficult subject. 02Another example is affirmation -- how do you do affirmation effectively? 02We all know that simply chanting mantras will not do the trick. 02Same goes for visualization, breathing, and the list just goes on and on. 02
We need a method that is as effective as it is idiot-proof, hence the creation of the SSILD technique. A large group of people, mainly novices, participated in testing the new method, and within months we received many hundreds of reports of success. 02And unlike some techniques that only work for the first couple of times, SSILD users report consistent result from regular usage. 02Many even learned to induce LDs and OBEs on daily basis.
Theory
We do not know why exactly SSILD works. 02One user pointed out that the method shares some resemblance with the self-hypnosis method introduced by02Betty Erickson, wife of the late Dr. Milton H. Erickson. 02Another theory is that by repeated stimulation of the various senses in a trance-like state, we incubate our mind and body into the right condition suited for entering a DILD, WILD, or OBE.
Regardless the theory, it is utterly crucial02to keep in mind that SEILD is not strictly a WILD technique. 02While many users report successful LD/OBE induction from the waking state, this method is equally effective at inducing DILDs. 02In fact, I ly suggest users treat it solely as a DILD technique in order to use it in the most effective manner. 02
Step-by-step02
1. The best time to practice is after 4 or 5 hours of sleep. 02You could also combine the practice with WBTB for maximum effect but it is not required. 02DO NOT do this at the start of your sleep -- it will NOT work! 02The only exception is afternoon naps since you enter directly into REM.02
2. Repeat the following procedures 4 or 5 times. 02DO NOT attempt too many repetitions even if you don't feel anything. 02Remember you are not doing a WILD. 02You are simply setting things up for OBEs and LDs to occur at later point. 02If you repeat too many times you may risk losing sleep thus destroys the purpose.02
2a) With your eyes closed, stare at the darkness behind your eyelids for 15-20 seconds. 02Try to pick up any colors, lights, or images, but do not strain your eye muscle. 02If you see nothing but darkness, that's fine. 02Again, we are not striving to induce dreams from the waked state, so do NOT force it. 02It is perfectly fine to not feel anything. 0202
2b) Listen to the noises in your ears for 15-20 seconds. 02Chances are you will hear some light humming and buzzing sound. 02See if you can hear it more clearly. 02If you don't hear anything that's okay.02
2c) Notice any strange body sensations such as heaviness, tingling, and movements. 02Pay attention particularly to the head, hands, fingers, abdomen, feet, and toes. 02Again, it is perfectly fine if you don't feel anything strange. 02
The above steps should be performed in a relaxed manner, slowly, lazily, and without any rational thoughts. 02The 15-20 seconds duration is for your reference only, so do NOT count in your head! 02Chances are, after a couple of repetitions you will begin to feel sleepy, to the point your mind may drift away and forget to continue the exercise. 02Congratulations, this is exactly the effect we are after! 02When this happens just pull your mind back a bit and resume from where you drifted away. 02If you lost count of the repetitions then simply do a new set. 02It won't hurt.02
3. Find the most comfortable position and try to fall asleep as quickly as possible! 02The quicker you fall asleep the more likely you will succeed later in your dreams!02
What's going to happen02
Several things may happen through this exercise:02
1. After you fall asleep, you may suddenly wake up with a strange sensation. 02You will feel wide awake, and your body weightless. 02At this point just do a reality check and roll out from your bed to begin an OBE.02
2. You wake up with vibrations and other strange sensations. Hung onto these sensations will lead you into an OBE.02
3. You suddenly become lucid in your dreams with no apparent reasons, or you may begin to suspect you are dreaming.
4. You have a False Awakening. 02Unlike the first experience, you may feel awake but still drowsy. 02FAs will occur frequently with SSILD, therefore you should get used to it and become good at identifying them.02
5. A WILD or direct OBE. 02Phase entrance may occur during the repetition, with your mind still awake. 02When this happens, many of the sensations become amplified. 02You should stop doing any further exercises, and begin focusing on the sensations until you successfully enter the phase.
6. If all else fail you can try the following technique as a last resort. Upon waking up again, which you eventually will after step 3, try relax your head and allow it to sink into the pillow. If done correctly you will generate vibrations and enter an OBE from a fully waked state. This works because SSILD has prepared your body and mind to enter a phase easily. In fact if you increase the number of repetitions you may be able to do this even before you fall asleep from step 3!02
About me02
I recently migrated to this forum from DreamView. 02I have been a member of DV for many years, and my personal research and practice on the subject of LD dates back in early 90s. 02Throughout the years I've recorded thousands of LDs and OBEs.02
Two years ago I joined a lucid dreaming forum in China, and since then have become one of their prominent writers and trainers. 02The forum quickly grew to over 60,000 active members. 02This provided me with an excellent test bed for new ideas. 02Together we developed and refined the SSILD method more than 8 months ago. 02Today it is being actively practiced and improved upon by thousands of people.
Common causes for loss of sleep
Being unable to fall asleep easily after the cycles is a common problem encountered by inexperienced users of the SSILD technique, there are several possible causes:
1. False Awakening. No I'm not kidding. What you are experiencing could well be an FA and this is very common after doing SSILD. You basically just lay there trying to fall asleep while you are already asleep. One way to work around this is to do additional repetitions when you find you are unable to sleep. Assuming you are in an FA, or sometimes a light trance, then the cycling technique will usually result in very apparent HIs, ringing sounds, vibrations, or other effects. When the effects occur you can simple do an RA, and then roll out of the bed to begin an OBE.
2. You are focusing too much on producing the effects/sensations while doing the reps. Remember, WILD and OBE are by products of SSILD. They should not be sought after. When you do the cycles, do NOT expect anything will happen. You should focus on losing focus. That's the right way to do SSILD.
3. Rational thoughts entering the mind while doing the cycles. It's fine to let your mind drift to other things, but you should NEVER analyize what you are doing! Oh, do NOT count either. You don't want precision!
4. Deliberately trying to relax. Remember, SSILD is very much a self hypnosis tool, so you should rely on that to put you into sleep. Don't mix in any relaxation techniques befor or after! And certainly do not attempt to stay relaxed during the repetitions. You just get comfortable, and leave the relaxation part to the technique.
5. Interruption. This is the single biggest killer. If you are repeatedly interrupted, whether by sudden noises, discomforts, or others, you should seize doing the exercise and go to sleep right away. You can always do it again later, so do not force it.
Last edited by cosmic.iron on Thu 19 Apr, 2012; edited 4 times in total
mattias wrote:
Just to see if I got it right, I focus on what I see for a few seconds, then on what I hear, then on what I feel, over and over a few times. Then I just try to fall asleep.
If I get vivid images/sounds/touch, I should just focus on them and do a WILD (like I did a few times, as mentioned above
-------
You summed it up really well. That's exactly the way to do it. You cycle through the sensations. Each cycle deepens your "state" and you may observe increased calmness and sensations. If one sensation becomes pronounced you should focus on increasing it, like what we typically do in WILD. Otherwise, just finish the cycles and go to sleep -- in this case, the cycles pretty much serves the purpose as mantras, except more effective (we all know that communicating to our subconscious via "spoken language" isn't particularly very effective). In addition, the repeated cycling also tends to create "inertia" which carries into your dreams -- similar to how FILD works.
Sometimes we experience sensations but not vivid enough. You can try focusing on it for a few seconds to see if you can increase it. If it stays the same then you should move on to the next steps. Don't do it for more than a few seconds.
What you said about relaxation is very true. Through my observation it is a major hurdle for many people, experienced LDers included. In fact, most of the time relaxation techniques tend to put the user into the wrong mind/body state. With SILD we don't need relaxation. Just give your body 4 to 5 hours of sleep and you should be well prepped. Let's face it -- there is no better and easier way to relax than simply to fall asleep, isn't it?
I hope you find this technique useful. Don't hesitate to ask any questions.
Cheers,
Gary
Jur1121 wrote:
Tried this technique early morning. I only repeated the vision/sound/feel cycle for a couple of times because I was tired and wanted to go sleep. Well... when I fell asleep I had a DILD for so long!
-------
So it worked!
mattias wrote:
I remembered to try it this morning, but there was too much noise outside and I was too tired from yesterday, so I had a hard time focusing on dreaming and didn't get really far with the technique. I had pretty good recall though, and a couple lucid moments (my main problem for the last 2 or 3 years has been to not wake up prematurely from my LD's... ). Anyway, I'll see if I give it another try tonight.
-------
A noisy environment is always a killer! Judging from the few lucid moments you had, you must have executed the technique correctly! The problem is that you were too tired and the interruption wasn't helping either. SILD has much better success rate if you are rested well! Let's hope you have better luck next time
sungodd wrote:
I gave this a try this morning. It was interesting. I have a semi-cold so was really hard to stay still and not swallow deeply. I went through it around 7 or 8 times, dozed off sometime in there, woke up not realizing i dozed off and did 1 more round and tried to move, hitting what felt like a wall. Which i broke through quickly before i realized what it was. Takes me forever to wake up, so I tend not be very coherent when first waking up. So pretty much blew a perfect chance for a deild. First time feeling what SP was like, or breaking through it. Going to give this another try tomorrow it was quite simple to do. Thanks
-------
Your physical condition made it harder to achieve success, but sounds like you are on the right track anyway When doing SILD, remember it is not necessary to stay completely motionless. You should feel as comfortable as possible, as long as you don't fall asleep before finishing the cycles. Stopping "intentionally" in middle of it is actually okay though.
It is perfectly fine to move somewhat during the exercise, swallowing included. In fact, at step 3c, where one scans for body sensations, one may do it so aggressively to the point she actually moves the physical body. While this is not encouraged as you may lose sleep, it is indeed fine and works equally well.
<mod>Stacked posts edited together </mod>
Leijona wrote:
Sounds promising, I may try it. Can you do whatever you want in order to fall asleep, like, you don't have to repeat a mantra or anything?
-------
Yes you should do whatever to fall asleep quickly. For me that means completely throw away everything and just DO it, but people may differ. No need to chant mantras and telling yourself you will be LDing later. That job has been done by the cycles. Just go to sleep, as quickly as possible. The quicker you can fall asleep, the easier it is for this to work. If you do plenty of repetitions and fall asleep quickly enough, chances are you will experience the strange sensation which you wake up suddenly into a trance with a very clear and alert mind. It feels like miracle.
Rhewin wrote:
I tried this as well. Like mattias I was pretty tired last night and had a harder time concentrating. I did notice vastly increased DR and vividness and a slightly more aware thought process. Definitely seems worth pursuing .
-------
Thank you for trying, Rhewin. Like I said in my other reply to you, I'm hoping together we can refine this promising method!
My suggestion to you is do NOT try this without enough rest, or you may experience anxiety during the exercise. Also do not "concentrate". In fact, you should do the opposite! Just do it in a lazy, relaxed manner for optimal result.
Hamza wrote:
well i tried this two times and it worked both times but after 5-6 sec of LD ing i wake up in my bed full of vibrations and strange sound in my head that stays until i get up and that wasn't FA i RC ed upon waking up
-------
LOL, sounds like you got the effects all overlapped When LDing, please try not to focus your attention to yourself; instead, focus on your surroundings. Otherwise you may end up being thrown back to bed with FA... of course, your case is kinda different...
Uneksija wrote:
This technique seems very interesting The only difficult part for me could be falling asleep quickly. Whenever I intentionally try to fall asleep I'm all tense(in mind, not body) and it takes ages. But I guess it can be mastered with practice and experience.
-------
Don't worry about that. The cycling of the senses, if done correctly, can pretty much push you to the edge of falling asleep. And if you have trouble letting go and fall asleep quickly, it is perfectly okay to do it slowly. Just remember, in this case you may drift into a FA without even noticing it. In some instances, you are still awake but your mind/body has already been fully prepped for an OBE. At this point all you need is a bit intention to trigger it. This of course, does require practice.
dB_FTS wrote:
Hy cosmic.iron! I'm very glad that you joined this forum, I hope you'll share as much knowledge as possible! I just want to learn!-------
Thank you so much! I am quite pleased with my experience on this forum so far. People seem very nice
The FILD tech does share a lot of similarities with SILD. You can actually replace step 3c with FILD... just don't do it for too long.
One of my favorite features of SILD is the many levels of backup plans:
1. You enter a trance while doing the exercise. This is WILD.
2. If no.1 fails, you fall asleep then wake up at some point later and enter trance. This is kind of an automatic DEILD.
3. If no. 2 fails, you become lucid in your dreams. This is DILD.
4. If all else fails you are still very likely to encounter a FA. It requires more skill to utilize it but that's better than nothing
As you gain more experience with SILD, you will come to trust its results. Then it will become very simple. With minimal work and without losing sleeps, you will be able to enjoy LD/OBE almost any time you want. In the few months since SILD's release, quite a few participants learned to induce LDs on a daily basis, and have since recorded hundreds of LDs. Quite impressive indeed! I hope this will work for you as well. Good luck!
SuperAlex wrote:
Sounds pretty interesting! Great technique. Only problem is that I can't force myself to wake up after 5-6 hours, because if I do so, I will never fall asleep again. I have deep insomnia.
But if I wake up by accident, I might as well do it I'll post in this thread when I get to use this technique!
-------
Sorry for your insomnia... that's painful indeed Depend on your sleep cycle, you can try SILD before you go to sleep. Some of the guys on my forum actually managed to achieve some good results. If you do wake up by accident, I suggest you to do it in a less intensive way -- reduce the number of repetitions, only passively scan for body sensations, etc.
<mod>Double posts edited together. </mod>
mattias wrote:
I started feeling vibrations very faintly but had a terrible itch which made them go away.
-------
It's okay to scratch you know Seriously, the whole point is to get as comfortable as possible so you can quickly fall asleep. Therefore if you feel itchy then you should definitely deal with it quickly. Don't worry about the viberation, it will come back quickly, and if it doesn't, you will get it later after you fall asleep.
The itch is also very likely an illusion. This may happen if you stay completely still. Your body uses this as a probe to see if you are truly asleep. There is a technique on DV that takes advantage of this, but it is extremely hard. The probing becomes so intense that most people just give up. You can stop doing SILD and focus on staying still, and if you are lucky you might move past the probing stage and experience the wonders of falling asleep from a waked state. However, this in general is not compatible with SILD because you will naturally become very tense while doing it.
Rhewin wrote:
Well another night gone by, this morning I was not in the right mindset at all. Something was upsetting me from the night before and I couldn't concentrate very well. Still, another increase in DR and vividness is pointing me toward trying for a while longer XD
-------
Thank you Rhewin, for your continuos support! next time pls let me know more details on how you were doing it so I might be able to help you diagnose. When you say you couldn't concentrate well, can you please clarify? Do you mean concentrating on the repetitions?
Cheers
<mod>Double posts merged together </mod>
elnaureth wrote:
I tried this this morning with moderate success. The record of it is here.
Where did the idea for this come from? It reminds me of this self-hypnosis technique.
-------
Very interesting! I just bookmarked the link so I can read it more carefully later. It is indeed VERY similar! The idea of SILD originated from some WILD technique I always used in the past. While working with people on the forum we streamlined and refine it together. The primary goal was to retain the success rate while taking away those "intricate" parts so it's easy for people to learn. We did a lot of experiments and the technique went through several revisions in the past few months.
elnaureth wrote:
I tried this this morning with moderate success. The record of it is here.
Where did the idea for this come from? It reminds me of this self-hypnosis technique.
-------
I read the link carefully. The resemblance between the two methods are astonishing! Thank you for pointing this out. This for sure will shed more light and give us more insight on why this works and how to further improve it!
Rhewin wrote:
I'll pay more attention tonight to give better feedback. By concentration issues I mean I tried to go through all the steps but my mind was drifting back to an issue I was having. It was an almost sleepless night for me, you see, so trying to focus on one or two things at a time wasn't the easiest thing. Everything seems in order for tonight, however.
-------
I see. As long as the thoughts don't become too rational and analytical it's generally fine. Just resume from where you drifted away or start all over again. Anyway, good luck tonight
dB_FTS wrote:
So here I will post my progress from last night and next 6 days!
-------
I'm sorry it didn't work for you this time, but you summed it up well. One thing to bear in mind is that while doing the repetitions do not do it too systematically... don't focus! Allow your mind to drift away is always better than concentrating. Also in step 3a don't stress your eye muscles since that may be the single biggest reason that's causing difficulty to fall asleep.
nightEagle wrote:
Great tech, cosmic.iron! I've been thinking for a while now about what to do with inner sounds / inner images. Thanks for sharing.
-------
Glad to help hope it will work for you!
<mod>Stacked posts edited together.</mod>
gamblino100 wrote:
well i tried this when i woke up in the night last night and woke up this morning with great dream recall, and i noticed that my attention to detail had highly increased when reading my dream journal writing. no lucidity in this dream.
however i tried again today when having a morning nap after taking my kids to school. when i woke up great dream recall again and a few short lucid moments in two seperate dreams. awesome i will be sure to try again tonight. thankyou!!
-------
Combining SILD with WBTB or morning nap is a great way to increase success rate!
Tyharo23 wrote:
cosmic.iron wrote:2c) From head to toe scan your body for any strange sensations such as heaviness, tinglings, movements, etc.
-------
Just a question...is it necesarry to do it from head to toe?-------
Interesting question! When I wrote "head to toe" I wasn't really being literal... but you did raise a very valid question and your findings might have some significance! I'll go back to my forum and ask them to do some experiment on this.
Huntstreet wrote:
Hello there. I'm very new to lucid dreaming and I've never had one before. Im not familiar with all of the methods, but I stumbled across this one and it looked perfect for me. I have a few questions that I'll ask in a short answer type format so itll be easier for you to respond to my multiple questions.-------
Nap is a great time to practice. What you experience is Sleep Paralasis. This usually happens as a leftover of REM during which your body is paralyzed. Since you only had so little time to sleep, your body needs to make up for the amount of REM you skipped. Thus, when you nap you almost immediately enter REM instead of going through the typical NREM-1, NREM-2 stuff. This is why it's so easy for you to experience SP. You can really take advantage of this, with or without using the SILD method. Of course, combining SILD will greatly increase your chance.
As for the sound, it is usually better if the environment is quiet so you can hear the inner noises. I suspect this is important just as you are not supposed to do the exercise with your eyes open. Your situation with the fan of course is unique, so I don't want to rule out the possibility that it might work for you. I guess we will have to find out by experimenting with it.
Lief wrote:
I want to try this tonight, but I must ask. How do I scan my body?
-------
The simplest way is to just look for any sensations that's out of ordinary. You can scan for it following certain order, such as from toe to head or vice versa, or you can simply do it randomly. I usually pay closer attentions to these areas though -- toes, fingers, abdomen, and head.
If you are not afraid of being too alert thus losing sleep, then you can try moving your hands, feet, or head with your mind without using muscles. Given the right circumstance they may actually start to move in a pretty wild fashion. In this case you know you are going to experience a WILD (no poun intended). However, you don't want to strain yourself in order to achieve this effect. Just in your mind mimic the sensation as best as you can. Even accidentally using your real muscles is perfectly okay. The key is to just DO IT! As long as you don't wake yourself too much.
ParanoiDave wrote:
Thanks for the technique, cosmic!
I've been struggling to induce one lucid dream. MILD has not been working, at all.
I will try this technique and report back here tomorrow. Thanks a lot; this seems like the technique for me!
-------
Problem with MILD is the affirmations which are difficult to get them right. SILD is simpler. Just remember, don't push yourself. If it works that's great, otherwise you should enjoy a good night of sleep because you will have plenty of opportunities in your life to experience LDs. That's the kind of mentality you should have, and then the method will work wonders for you.
lucky1990 wrote:
Hey Cosmic .Iron,
Welcome to this forum,
I have quick short three questions.
a) Is it mandatory to sleep immediately after doing two-three rounds or we can sleep afterwards?
b) Should i silence the thoughts in my mind while doing these cycles or can i ignore thoughts and also whether can i ignore thoughts of excitement, which sometimes prevents me from falling asleep quickly, after doing these rounds?
c) Should i look for real sounds/ sensations etc while doing the rounds or should imagine sounds.sensations?
Thank you!!!!
-------
a) It is not mandatory. In fact, personally when I sometimes double the number of repetitions, then afterward my mind/body will be prepped into such condition that I can just create an OBE with a simple intention while being wide awake. Of course, this takes practice so I don't want to recommend this. In general though, the quicker you fall asleep the better.
b) You absolutely don't want to silence your thoughts! Those thoughts help put you closer to the trance. As long as they are not too rational and stressful you will be fine. While emptying your thoughts is an essential skill for meditation and often suggested by many LD techniques, SILD is designed to be just the opposite. Those random thoughts are your friends, not your enemies! Don't waste your mental energy to try to kill them! Let them grow and go with the flow!
c) It matters not. It's the action that matters. Whether or not you hear anything is not important, as long as you tried to hear them.
Leijona wrote:
I'm sorry if this has been asked before, but does it matter in which position you do the steps? I for one lose my concentration very easily when I lay down, so I'm thinking about trying this in another position, like sitting.
-------
I suggest a position that's comfortable, but not your typical one used to fall asleep with. I'm not sure about sitting... but you are welcome to try One more thing, don't "concentrate"! You should allow your mind to drift away. Keep your mind on a leash but not a tight one.
Lief wrote:
Just a quick update for me last night.-------
Dear Lief, reading through your report it occurs to me you might have missed many opportunities to experience a perfect WILD and OBE.
The time you actually saw picture is the first sign of getting into a WILD. You see, it's normal for the first few repetitions to not feel anything, but usually each repetition will bring you closer to the correct mind/body state then you will start to get sensations. When you do experience and distinctive sensations like this, you should immediately cease the exercise and focus on the sensation instead. By focusing on it the sensation will increase, assuming you are not getting too excited and break out of the trance. In the case of yours, the image you saw will eventually become bigger and brighter. At which point you should be able to do a nose RC and it usually will work. Or, you can try reaching out to the scene and that usually will allow you to zoom right into it and becomes a dream.
Another place you missed an opportunity is when you felt the rocking sensation and some vibrations. Again, you should have stopped the exercise and focused on increasing the sensation. When the range of the movement becomes bigger and bigger, you are already in a perfect condition to experience an OBE. Just do a quick nose RC and you should be able to roll out of your bed.
Don't despair, as you become more experienced to these sensations you will eventually be able to grab them. You are actually on the right track judging from your experience.
About losing sleep... typically when doing SILD, we do not expect to experience any sensations. That's right, you heard me correctly -- we ARE NOT striving to experience anything while doing the exercise! It's the action that matters, not the result! It is perfectly fine for you to not feel anything. Just finish the cycles, become plenty relaxed, and drift to sleep as quickly as possible. LDs and OBEs will come automatically at later stage. If you do it in this fashion, these exercises will actually help you sleep! On the other hand, if you focus too much on the sensations, you will become too eager and tense, and that will result in difficulty to fall asleep afterwards. In your case, it's even worse because you were literally on the verge of WILD and OBE and you broke out of them
ParanoiDave wrote:
Update...
I wasn't able to fully do the technique. I set my alarm for the usual time, which last night was close to 4 1/2 hrs after going to sleep.
When I tried to do the technique, I ran through the steps only twice, and for some reason, I told myself "I think it's working..." and just fell back asleep. I end up doing this with a lot of techniques. I don't know why. Maybe it's because I'm tired.
No recall... At all.
I AM going to try this again tonight. In fact, I'm going to try until I can induce a lucid dream.
I had a quick question though:
I was thinking about using Melatonin tonight before I went to bed. I haven't used a dreaming supplement yet. Do you think taking a supplement along with using this technique would be useful or have no effect?
-------
Please take a look at the reply I gave to Lief. Many of the answers apply to you as well
I think you were right that you may have been too tired for this to work. Two repetitions then fell asleep usually is not enough. Also it's usually better if you get out of your bed for at least 5 minutes before doing the exercise.
I suggest you not to mix the exercise with other techniques... at least not until you have experienced some success. Certain techniques are just not compatible!
Lief wrote:
Well then, that boosts my mood up a lot! I'll try setting an alarm and doing this again tonight and post back on here in the morning. If I see or feel anything intense or vivid, I'll hold on to it like you said. I didn't know it was as easy as doing an RC when it gets intense enough. Thank you for the help!
-------
You see, each of the 3 steps by themselves is a traditional WILD technique. Staring at hypnogogic imagery is a very typical way to generate a WILD. Once you start seeing things, focusing on them will increase their intensity. As the picture becomes intense (especially when it becomes animated), it's time to do an RC and get up. Doing this usually results in an OBE. You can also wait a bit longer, and then try to reach out to the scene such as grabbing something from it. This will put you right into an LD. Waiting yet longer the scene might actually envelope you and automatically forms a dream around you. This of course, is not recommended because you may get too excited during this process and cause the sensation to go away.
The SILD cycling, compared to the individual technique, has the advantage of moving you deeper to the trance a lot more quickly and causes less stress. I have to emphasis again though -- do NOT go after the sensations deliberately! If it happens it happens, but do not go after them!
<mod>Double posts edited together </mod>
Lief wrote:
So you suggest getting up for a couple minutes? I thought I recalled earlier that you said even moving the slightest muscles could possibly wake you up too much..
-------
After you wake up from the alarm, you should get up and stay awake for 5 mintues. Some people don't want to do this because that may cause them difficulty to fall back to sleep. You should experiment.
The "not moving a single muscle" is from a different technique, LOL! While doing SILD you should feel as comfortable as possible, and if that means moving a bit then by all means do it! If you hava an itch then feel free to scratch! While feeling body sensations you can even move your fingers using muscles (that's basically the FILD method). SILD is very forgiving
lucky1990 wrote:
Cosmic.iron,
This may be connected or unconnected from this technique, but how do I keep my cool while experiencing Sleep Paralysis? -------
SP is nothing to be afraid of. For us LDers it's actually a blessing. Of course, if you experience SPs frequently then it's probably a health issue. You might need to improve your physical condition as well as adjusting your schedules.
One more thing to note: do not mistaken OBE sensations with SP. It is not unusual to get an OBE when doing SILD. When that happens you will experience vibrations, ringing noises, falling sensations, and etc. Don't be afraid. It means you are succeeding!
Synergy86 wrote:
This method be used without the 4-5hrs of sleep? Also if I were to awake 4-5 hrs into my night how long do I need to be awake untill using this method. All in all I'm excited to go home and try it, I think I'll use it as my primary when I initially go to sleep, I work nights so I don't know if that might enhance it.
-------
Without 4-5 hours of sleep the method will not work very well. In general, 5 to 10 minutes staying awake should be enough. Any longer than that may cause difficulty to fall back sleep. I personally just get up to empty the bladder, then go back to bed immediately.
<mod>Double post edited together. Please use the edit button instead of stacking posts. </mod>
dB_FTS wrote:
But in SILD we fall asleep very fast so what kind of preparation do we actually do by doing SILD!? -------
Glad it worked for you
As for your question, I honest do not have the answer. It's just through hundreds of case studies we find that doing these simple repetitions combined with fast falling asleep somehow result in dramatic increase in OBE, DILD, and FA afterwards, all without requiring great effort. There are a lot of speculations on why it works but, well, they are just speculations
OddDreamingDreamer wrote:
And for anyone who asks, I'm no expert, but I think the most important thing in this technique is to fall asleep comfortably!
-------
OddDreamingDreamer, the advice you gave in the above quote definitely hits the bull's-eye!
ParanoiDave wrote:
When you say to "find the most comfortable position," does that mean it is alright to change position after performing the reps, or am I supposed to stay in that position and fall asleep? I was confused when attempting it during a nap because I loved the feeling of the trance I was in and I didn't want to ruin it. I performed the reps on my back but I usually sleep on one of my sides.
-------
ParanoiDave, it is okay to change positions. In fact that's what I normally do. I like to sleep on my left side. When I'm working on the exercise I lay flat, then upon finish I roll to the left side so I can quickly fall asleep. It is important that you feel comfortable in either position though.
Zzz wrote:
I have to say that this technique is the best I've tried for a beginner like me.-------
Thank you Zzz, glad it helps. When you felt you were swimming, which actually happens quite commonly among people, you should have stopped the repetition and focused on increasing that sensation. My own experience is when this swimming sensation occurs, it will eventually rock you back and forth so hard that you literally get ejected out of your body! Very cool trick!
thebotanyofsouls wrote:To answer the person who asked about the body-scan, I recommend thinking about touching every surface on your body with an area roughly 5cm in diameter-------
Thanks thebotanyofsouls, the advice you gave on how to scan for body sensations is very useful!
mattias wrote:
cosmic.iron wrote:
My own experience is when this swimming sensation occurs, it will eventually rock you back and forth so hard that you literally get ejected out of your body! Very cool trick!
-------
This is exactly what happened to me last night although I wasn't doing SILD, it was just luck, I guess.
Quick question, what if you fall asleep during the repetitions? Is that a problem or does it only depend on how many repetitions I was able to make before falling asleep?It's perfectly okay to fall asleep while doing it . Although it probably means you are too tired, and that could have an impact on the result.
My feeling is you are doing it too rhythmically. Don't count the breathe. You don't want precise timing. The idea is to do it in the most relaxed manner... let your mind drift... Even though the duration of each repetition does not need to be the same -- as you drift away the later repetitions might take seem forever LOL, you don't want this intentional shorter-to-longer progression.
About the various sensations, if they happen vividly then you should pause and focus on increasing them. Ignore the minor ones though! The idea of SILD is to prep your mind/body for phase entrance AFTER you fall asleep. WILD during the repetition stage is only a side-effect and should not be sought after. Do SILD in the most relaxed manner, don't spend too much time. Let's it do wonders for you after you fall asleep. SILD should not cause you sleeless nights. If it does, then you are changing it to a different technique. Hope this helps.
mattias wrote:
thebotanyofsouls wrote:
By 6-8 breaths per sense I am fully paralyzed, observing steady tingling sensations, and there is 0 hypnagogic imagery behind my eyelids - just pretty colors.
-------
These pretty colors are probably hypnagogic imagery, but just the early stages. You usually start out with colors and patterns which then start turning into more defined shapes and then full scenes.
And ok, I guess I should try to find a balance between falling asleep during the process and taking long to fall asleep after ir . I ended up trying it a bit this morning, but I mixed in some MILD too. Plus I did a WBTB and ate a banana, so all of those might have helped my lucidity (I didn't wake up right away, so that's cool!).mattias, so it worked! Yes, mixing in MILD and WBTB will definitely increase your chance with SILD, or you could say vice versa, LOL.
@ShaneTheShaman and @zziga, glad it worked. Please post more details when you have time as the experience will help us further improve the technique! Thank you!
ShaneTheShaman wrote:
Just one question, when you say to scan your body, do you mean to stay in a still position and feel the senses on your hands and toes, or do you actually wiggle your toes and move your hands?
-------
Actually you can do either. Wiggling will probably create better result, but may wake you too much. You need to find what best suits you
thebotanyofsouls wrote:
fun fact: that meditative exercise, applied for 10 years straight and using increasingly smaller focus points, was how the Buddha finally attained enlightenment - it's called vipassana meditation, and is very useful for beginning and experienced meditators alike.
-------
That's very interesting! I need to check that out!
thaifly wrote:
So my question is: does this technique require you to lie on your back / does it loose its effectiveness if lying on your side or stomach? For some reason I only expect to get into SP while lying on my back.
Thanks.SPs do not always occur when using SILD so don't fear too much -- it might be a different experience next time. As for your question, it doesn't matter what position you use to sleep. Just use one that's comfortable, but not so comfortable that you fall asleep right away without completing at least a few cycles.
Rhewin wrote:
I finally used this properly and had success with it. After waking up a second time I was able to easily induce a WILD as HI came on during the vision part.
-------
Glad it worked, Rhewin. Your observation makes a lot of sense. I look forward to hear more your feedbacks.
Spiering98 wrote:
Does it work to if you have a nap before you go to sleep cause i don 't think i can set my alarm just for a chance to have a LD cause it will make everbody angry but i might try it if i wake up in the night after 4 hours (which i most of the time do). and can i do it to if i'm not tired at night?
-------
I personally never use an alarm since I always need to get up for the bathroom at night. So yes, you can do this any time you get up at night naturally. Not too sure about your question regarding the nap... Do you mind re-phrase your question?
gemini.moon wrote:Any advice on what I should do differently?
-------
1. Sounds to me you are falling asleep way too fast, LOL. I suggest you to either get up after six hours sleep or stay awake for at least 5-10 minutes before you start SILD.
2. The sensation you felt is the typical phenomenon experienced when your body attempts to fall asleep when it detects long period of immobility. When you stay immobile for a while, your body, assuming it is sufficiently tird, will attempt to go to sleep. In order to make sure your mind is already asleep (as a safety measure perhaps), the body sends out a very signal literally shouting "I'm uncomfortable!". If you respond to it by rolling or other movement then your body will seize to go to sleep; otherwise you body falls asleep and you experience some very strange sensations as it does that. This is in fact a very effective way to WILD but it requires an iron will and takes a long time to accomplish.
When the above happens, it's always a good indication that you are doing SILD in a wrong way. SILD does not require you to stay still. You should be as comfortable as possible! If you feel an itch, just scratch it. If you want to roll, do it! Just do a couple of extra repetitions to compensate for the interruption will be enough.
It seems all of the above questions share something in common -- not being able to fall asleep after the reps, therefore I will provide the answer in one single post.
Being unable to fall asleep easily after the repetitions is a common problem encountered by inexperienced users of the SILD technique, there are several possible causes:
1. False Awakening. No I'm not kidding. What you are experiencing could well be an FA and this is very common after doing SILD. You basically just lay there trying to fall asleep while you are already asleep. One way to work around this is to do additional repetitions when you find you are unable to sleep. Assuming you are in an FA, or sometimes a light trance, then the cycling technique will usually result in very apparent HIs, ringing sounds, vibrations, or other effects. When the effects occur you can simple do an RA, and then roll out of the bed to begin an OBE.
2. You are focusing too much on producing the effects/sensations while doing the reps. Remember, WILD and OBE are by products of SILD. They should not be sought after. When you do the cycles, do NOT expect anything will happen. You should focus on losing focus. That's the right way to do SILD.
3. Rational thoughts entering the mind while doing the cycles. It's fine to let your mind drift to other things, but you should NEVER analyize what you are doing! Oh, do NOT count either. You don't want precision!
4. Deliberately trying to relax. Remember, SILD is very much a self hypnosis tool, so you should rely on that to put you into sleep. Don't mix in any relaxation techniques befor or after! And certainly do not attempt to stay relaxed during the repetitions. You just get comfortable, and leave the relaxation part to the technique.
5. Interruption. This is the single biggest killer. If you are repeatedly interrupted, whether by sudden noises, discomforts, or others, you should seize doing the exercise and go to sleep right away. You can always do it again later, so do not force it.
I hope this explains it. Oh, thank you all for joining the experiment!
jordangamevi wrote:
I am new to LDs and have only been experimenting for about 5 days now, this techniques was the first to work for me and works everytime, i think its because it takes me a while to fall asleep and my mind wonders for a long time every night before I eventually fall asleep.
The problem im having however is that when i do start dreaming, I get so caught up in the dreams because they are so vivid, that i completely forget to do RCs or even realise im dreaming to become lucid. When i wake up i can remember the dreams vividly and recall Dream Signs but i cant become lucid in them, basically i haven't gotten to that "This is a dream" moment yet even though i try to convince myself before attempting LDs
Any suggestions?
-------
In order to realize that you are dreaming, you need to bring more waking consciousness into your dream. SILD alone may not be able to do that. I suggest you combine the exercise with a WBTB routine. For example, wake up after having slept for 5 hours, stay awake for 10 minutes, then go back to bed.
gemini.moon wrote:
I've been trying this a lot lately, and I still have problems because I fall asleep way too quickly. I get up and will be wide awake, but the moment I start the technique I fall asleep within the first few seconds. What can I do to fix this?
-------
Are you doing WBTB?